This episode of Shoot the Moon features Dennis Dimka, Founder & CEO of UpTime Legal Systems. Dennis and his team came to Revenue Rocket for help with verticalizing and developing UpTime Legal's go-to-market strategy. Revenue Rocket's Director of Strategy Chelsey Nord, weighs in on the benefits of organic strategy consulting relating to the growth of business.
Win your vertical market! Below are some points discussed in this episode:
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Matt Lockhart 00:02
Welcome to another edition of the Shoot the Moon podcast presented by Revenue Rocket. As you know, Revenue Rocket is the premier growth strategy and M&A partner to IT services companies worldwide. excited to have you here excited for our podcast today, because we've got a couple of special guests. We're without our partner, Mike today, our founding partner who's galavanting around the world. But we do have our partner Ryan Barnett, welcome, Ryan.
Ryan Barnett 00:39
Hey, Matt. And thanks, everyone for listening to this podcast and appreciate everyone being on today. I very excited, we've got a few people here that are really going to dig into our why strategy matters when you're taking a look at the overall market and go to market strategy. So I'd like to introduce Chelsey Nord from Revenue Rocket. And Dennis Dimka from Uptime Legal. Chelsey, Chelsea is our strategy, lead and Revenue Rocket and will be helping out here. Hi, Chelsey.
Chelsey Nord 01:11
Hi, Ryan. Great to be back. I was on a previous podcast. But I'm excited to kind of get back in the seat here. And I know we're an amazing company here with Dennis. So great to be here. Thank you.
Ryan Barnett 01:23
Great. Thanks, Chelsey. And often, Dennis not just a little bit of work here. Dennis is a has been a client of revenue rocket in the past. And we've done some work together. And is has really been a very interesting champion of the SPP process. So today, we're going to dig a bit into why strategy matters for Uptime Legal. And so, Dennis, thank you so much for joining us today.
Dennis Dimka 01:51
Yeah, thanks for having me. I'm a longtime listener of Shoot the Moon. So it's exciting to be here.
Ryan Barnett 01:58
We're great to hear that and a lot of a note here at the end. But if you're a listener as well, we love talking to the listeners and and sometimes they make the best guests. So again, thank you so much, Dennis, I'd love to learn a little bit more about Uptime Legal. Can you tell us a little bit more about what you do? Once your target market? What's your your journey been so far?
Dennis Dimka 02:20
Absolutely. So Uptime Legal. We are a legal technology company. Broadly speaking law firms come to us from across North America to with help managing their technology and growing their business. We've we've been in business like over 15 years now. And we started long ago as a generalist MSP, I guess you could say, providing generic IP services. Today, I like to think that we're a national specialist. And we provide cloud services, we provide software and digital marketing services exclusively to law firms are one vertical.
Ryan Barnett 03:04
So when you when you talk about that in you, you've got one vertical market that came after us fascinating. So you started out as a generalist? Was there challenges when you're a generalist? When you started out? Targeting companies or selling to companies or even servicing them?
Dennis Dimka 03:26
Yes, and I think a lot of those challenges were more like forecasted challenges, meaning I felt them coming up. So in terms of like, when we verticalized, you know, what, what challenge were we trying to solve early in our company's life? You know, as that kind of generalist MSP CSP, we were growing fast. We were doing well. Back looking but forward looking, I could definitely feel that that financial gravity kicking in, right, I knew or I could sense maybe would be a better word, that that same growth rate wouldn't continue into the future if we changed nothing, right, if we stuck with the status quo. So that is that is what led us to really say, Okay, we're gonna we're going to really go all in on virticalization.
Ryan Barnett 04:18
Yeah, it's always really hard to be everything to everyone. And when that happens in here, you're diluting a lot of the expertise that you have, and it's hard for someone to recognize and identify with, with someone. So you've done a nice job of taking a generalist approach and bringing it to a market.
Dennis Dimka 04:43
Thank you. Yeah, I think the dilute the perfect word. It was it was always difficult to stand out as a generalist and I think it's, it can be very challenging to demonstrate a real unique value proposition, even if you believe it's a real differential or a real unique value proposition, it doesn't always resonate with your audience, I think the way you think it might when you're a generalist.
Matt Lockhart 05:08
It's funny that you say that Dennis, we hear this a lot, right from from our clients that, you know, they say, Well, look, we're, we've got the best people, or were the best, right? And, you know, they sit and they they look at their, their clients or their prospects and, and their prospects kind of give them this look like, what what, right. I mean, everybody says that
Dennis Dimka 05:38
Couldn't agree more, or ours is the best customer service, which don't get me wrong, super important, but that you just sound like everybody else, unfortunately.
Ryan Barnett 05:49
Yeah, it's a it that's, that's part of the reason why when we look at firms, and we look at the fastest path to growth, and the fastest path, or frankly profitability, we look at, we look at through the lens of what we call SVP. And what that means is, we want companies to specialize in an offering, and be able to have an offering that's very specific to your target market. And that brings to the vertical eyes, we want companies to target a vertical market, and look to be the number one or number two provider of that market. That's critical to find a market that's big enough to matter, but small enough for you to really put your stake in the ground as the number one provider, and then ultimately look for companies to productize their offerings, when you productize your offerings, you're making them easy to buy and easy to sell. And when you start to combine those three things, it's it's easier to target a market in target to go after a few thanks. Chelsey does this often. Chelsey I'll hand it over to you.
Chelsey Nord 06:58
Yeah, I was just gonna say thank you for sharing that Dennis, as far as your your articulation of the landscape, or what it looked like before you decided to verticalized because I think that a lot of our listeners, and others out there listening can really empathize or connect with the kind of pain points that you've had around, just stalled growth or, or hitting the glass ceiling. And getting to that next level really does take strong leadership to be able to sit put a stake in the ground and drive focus. Lots of people would, you know, would rather play it safe and kind of be everything to everyone or a jack of all trades. But if you really want to get to that next level, you have to put a stake in the ground. And as you've done, and excited to hear more about your story there. And one thing that you were kind of describing that that came to mind was just around what happens with focus that drives expertise, repetition and kind of the ability to keep up on innovation, which all helps from a competitive advantage standpoints. I'm super interested to hear about the competitive nature and and how that's shifted over time for you as well.
Dennis Dimka 08:08
Certainly, and I think to your point, you know, the advice I would give or the the thing I think we did, right, is we went all in and I think anyone looking to virtualize shouldn't go all in you know, it shouldn't be a thin veneer. But yeah, to your point, you're right, you know, what we, what the promise was, and it proved absolutely true in our case was, you know, when verticalize instead of, you know, blending in, you stand out. When you verticalize, it the discussion becomes a lot more about value and expertise rather than price, right. And I think being a generalist is a surefire way to to have your margins eroded. And I think it's just It also makes so many other things just kind of snap into focus. It certainly did for us, right, like all things strategy that might otherwise be difficult to make decisions around, really snap into focus, both from a competitive standpoint, and just from, a who are we and where are we going perspective?
Chelsey Nord 09:16
Yeah, absolutely. They lose their risk benefit to how you mobilize your team behind you know, achieving that vision as well. Great.
Ryan Barnett 09:29
So, Dennis, your name your company's Uptime Legal. How did you? How do you focus on how to pick with the just start there?
Dennis Dimka 09:40
Yeah, so once, you know, going back to these early these early days, you know when we acknowledged okay, we need to realize that the next obvious question is what vertical and I think it's really important. You guys have mentioned this in previous podcasts and I'll echo what I think it's really, really important to pick one, not two, not three, but one. And I can talk more about that, if you like, how we arrived at legal? You know, we looked at our client base, you know, we looked at, you know, what did our makeup look like. And I think as a generalist, it was a little bit of everything kind of a kitchen, sink it business. But we did have a good amount of law firms as clients. And we had, we kind of realized that we had a pretty good handle on law firms software, legal technology in general, and to a degree, the culture of law firms. Right, so given that we were already a really a cloud first company, it made sense that the intersection of law firms and legal tech, and cloud felt like the right path forward like that's at that intersection is where we could put, as you say, are sticking the ground in work to be that number one or number two provider
Ryan Barnett 11:02
So when you're looking at this was this... I love this fascinating. I didn't, I didn't realize that, that you mentioned you knew the culture of a law firm. And you knew that the technology of that? Does that also mean that you knew that bit of the vernacular? And they knew a bit of the terminology or that the pains that they had?
Dennis Dimka 11:23
Yes. So we knew everything from you know, what, what, what software, if you're a generalist, the amount of software applications that you might be called to support or to host or to deal with is essentially limitless, right, and you can't be an expert in everything. So that's why I think that a lot of generalists don't go very deep into supporting any one application beyond like the table stakes Microsoft's that we hadn't happened to have by just kind of a series of signing a certain number of law firm clients got a little deeper and learned about law firm software, which I think put us in a good position to take that the next step further. And yes, we also learned about, you know, the inner workings of a, of a law firm, the culture, you know, for little things, and big things that that matter, that are hard to articulate why they matter, but they do when you're when you're selling when you're delivering the service. You know, how time is quantifiably valuable to a law firm? You know, what a partner is? What an associate is, you know, what everybody's role in a law firm is, and who cares about which pieces of technology is something we knew and continue to learn.
Ryan Barnett 12:44
Yeah, it's great. It's great feedback. I think one of the hard parts when firms go into this, is if you're going to do something new, it's really hard to pick up on the subtleties. And it sounds like what you've done is you spent a lot of time in law offices, and you spent time with your customers and you spent time understanding what was important. Am I reading that? Right? Or hearing that right?
Dennis Dimka 13:09
A percent, Yes. You know, we would we and I personally, would, you know, if we would do some work for our client, you know, we might hang out at their office a little longer and talk shop, but learn about their business. I found it interesting academically anyway. So, yes, so that way, you know, it's not just about talking the talk, it's really understanding where they're coming from, where their challenges are, and what do they want? What are they really want from a provider or a solution?
Ryan Barnett 13:38
Yeah, Did you do any kind of surveys, or any kind of customer advisory board or anything that else that helps supplement and understand your your expertise within the legal market?
Dennis Dimka 13:53
Yes, we were engaging with you guys ad Revenue Rocket around how to properly implement SVP. And we certainly had some ideas, but we needed some guidance, and we got it. And one of the pieces of that process was some market research around the legal industry as it relates to tax. So like what, for instance, you know, what, where does technology spend go in a law firm? Does it go to Marketing? Does it go to software? Does it go to infrastructure, those kinds of things? And that helped us kind of frame up for us what was the next step, which was offering development and what should we do? What should we not be doing for this market?
Ryan Barnett 14:34
It takes a ton of research and a ton of time to understand kind of where you're starting to narrow things down and to understand that technology ecosystem. Sometimes if you're pulled in with a partner that can be a good guidance or good help. And did it the time to do it. Were you starting to formulate some of these Technology Partnerships with the legal software?
Dennis Dimka 15:05
Yes, you know, we had at that time, we had one or two partnerships with what you know, you would consider to be, you know, very big legal software publishers and kind of similar legal tech companies. And having having had one of those was for us just another reason in the column of legal as the vertical we should go after. And then yes, over time, many of them came to us over time, right? We didn't necessarily seek them out. But over time, somebody's you know, big name, would reach out to us and say, Hey, we heard of you, you know, we've got the software product, maybe we're looking for a cloud solution for it, and we don't want to build something in house, can we work with you? So that's another benefit of verticalization? Is your shine you stand out not just to potential customers, but to influential partners, I think as well.
Ryan Barnett 15:57
Yeah. Such a great point.
Matt Lockhart 16:01
Dennis, backing up just to touch, you know, you're you're somewhat unique in the sense that virticalization is a is a is a big step, you know, and we see, you know, challenges for many firms and, and quite honestly, taking that step and getting, you know, that sort of singular focus, you know, a lot of times people can sort of dip their toes and, and, and or they say, Well, we're gonna we're gonna verticalize around, you know, these four markets. You know, was that a challenge for you? I'm sure, again, I'm sure that you had to sort of give up some business along the way and furious about, you know, kind of Crossing the Chasm there.
Dennis Dimka 16:56
Yeah, you know, it was, it was a lot like the analogy I've heard you guys use of jumping off a cliff. And it's a big leap of faith, hopefully researched faith. The challenge was, first was just like, an inner challenge all set, you know, and it was me thinking about, okay, is, this is a big risk or not a big risk. This is a big change. Is it the right one, and I believed it, I believed in the philosophy, then the next step was, you know, kind of gathering my top leadership and saying, Okay, guys, here's the new strategy. Here's what I'm thinking. And I had no idea what to expect, in terms of was it going to be adopted? Was it going to be, you know, are they going to have some of the same anxieties that I had had? And the short answer to that is, they embrace it wholesale pretty, pretty quickly. And it was really it for us as a team to it was a unifying kind of almost, you know, rallying cry, like, this is our new direction. And we were all really excited about it. I'll say to, though, that, you know, I, I like your example of like, picking five verticals? You know, to me, I think, for us, the key to our successful verticalization is primarily really true thing. Like if I had to give two pieces of advice, that would be these number one, you know, don't half-ass it, right? Don't as you say, Ryan, don't just dip your toe in. I think your vertical focus can't just be a thin veneer on top of what you're already doing, meaning it can be business as usual. And you tap day for XYZ industry at the end of it. I don't think that's verticalization. I think that's a webpage. I think that's I think you really have to go all in. And I think the other thing is, you know, you can't, I would advise, you know, I was talking to somebody, an MSP or a CSP to pick one vertical. Otherwise, I think you undermine the value of why you would verticalized in the first place. And if you're and I can almost hear it too, like if you're, if you're the owner, or CEO of an MSP CSP, or a tech company might say, guys, really, let's be honest, technology is technology, right? It's Windows servers, it's routers, it's firewalls, it's software, it's all these things, and it largely doesn't change from from industry to industry, or the differences is not that much. And I would say, maybe, but your clients certainly don't see it that way. And I think if you say, Oh, we're an industry expert, quote, unquote, in manufacturing, and financial services and this other thing, I just don't think that's credible. So those are my two pieces of advice I would give to somebody pick one, and go all in and dip your toe in.
Matt Lockhart 19:56
Yeah, certainly not credible. If you're unless maybe if If you're a billion dollar organization, you can have a few different vertical expertise. That's, that's, you know, great advice, Dennis, it it, I think for for for you guys, your, your clear different differentiation is your knowledge of your customers and and your knowledge of your customers comes through that focus. And I'm sure that knowledge just continues to build and build. And so that's where you get clear differentiation. And then you're able to I'm sure layer on specialized offerings and, and specialized services and specialized technology because of your, your growing knowledge in that space.
Dennis Dimka 20:56
I couldn't agree more. You know, and then the the essence of SVP is specialization, which I think probably is often thought about in terms of technical specializations. But I think what happens over time is, is your industry specialization becomes just as an important of an S, as you know, the particular tech competencies that you have.
Chelsey Nord 21:19
Yeah, I was just gonna, I was just going to note that, as you're talking about this Dennis, it kind of makes me go back to a earlier blog or conversation that we had around, just really what is strategy and is a leader able to kind of drive that forward. And you clearly have been able to do that, because strategy is all about just making choices. So the ability to to, to make a choice on a vertical is the first step right to be able to put the stake in the ground for them. The second piece is making the right choice. Seems like you've certainly kind of found the recipe for success there. As far as you know, finding an area within legal where you've had some success, you've had good relationships with customers and partners, and baby being able to just double down on that. So that's just one thought I had. The other piece I was going to ask about is, you know, the economies of scale piece, so you've touched a little bit a couple times on how your team found this, this idea and getting on board with verticalization as refreshing. Just the focus and the rallying cry that comes around that. I was wondering, you know how things transformed as far as economies of scale? You know, if you with focus, comes repetition, and sometimes we would hope to see, you know, you're solving the similar types of problems over and over again, and lots of times there's a benefit to that as far as producing more on a large scale, and being more efficient, I guess. Have you experienced that? Or what are what's kind of your reflection point on that part?
Dennis Dimka 23:03
Yes, absolutely. And probably that was almost an unplanned benefit, you know, there was looking back now, you know, so many years later, there's so many little and medium and big things that are just cleaner, and simpler and clearer. Like that, right. Like, for instance, I'll go back to my earlier example, around to your point on efficiency. And if you're a generalist, say CSP, and you're in the business of hosting almost any piece of software that a customer hands you and they say make it work. That's a That's a tall order. And it may not work, or it may work. But it may require more, and you have to go back to the client. And it's, it's just challenging, because there's, again, there's a limitless amount of problems to potentially solve to your point. Whereas once you've verticalized, certainly in our experience, there's a finite list of things law firms use by and large, right? Software, applications, hardware, things like that. So we can truly and actually become experts in those. And then as you say, we're solving the same problems over and over, which means more efficiency, which means we do a better job for our clients. And we're not, you know, spinning our tires and wasting resources, time and money, solving a problem that will probably never see you again. So yes, I think that's absolutely true.
Ryan Barnett 24:21
Now, just a great, it's so great to hear someone who went all in and it's it's fascinating. You took it to the next level. When you're starting out with legal tech and you think of your traditional tech stack, maybe looking at the infrastructure of a law firm or looking at the applications but a law firm, but you brought mergers and acquisition into the mix too. Can you take tell us a little bit about how m&a has been a tool for helping you fulfill the vision of addressing the legal market?
Dennis Dimka 25:02
Absolutely. I think I think SVP and m&a are two peas in a pod. So growth via acquisitions has always been on my radar. Since the early stages, you know, I aspired to grow both organically and through acquisitions. But how to go about it was super unclear. Do we, you know, do we find another CSP or MSP or some kind of software company? You know, do we do a geographic expansion, like, there's just so many options, and none of them stood out as the obvious path. As I thought about it, right kind of before engaging in any real m&a projects, once we verticalized the path forward for m&a, as with so many other things just became clear, it just snapped into focus. So yeah, that's where it's at today, we've done a number of acquisitions, and they all align to our vertical strategy. So for instance, we've done we've acquired two digital marketing agencies that do you know, SEO and PPC and web design and that kind of thing for law firms. That's now a division of our company that we call juris page. We've also acquired another company that does also similarly to our first business, private cloud for law firms, we acquired that, again, they only serve law firms, we rolled that into our cloud business. So these were natural fits. And they were clear, they were clear fits because of verticalization. You guys talk a lot about when you're doing an m&a project, you look for that strategic fit that cultural fit that financial fit, I think when you've got a strong verticalization strategy, and the strategy part of that really becomes clear early on.
Ryan Barnett 26:55
Yeah, you're absolutely right. And when you're looking at the m&a process in which you're developing that ideal prospect profile, and when you put the constraint of a vertical market on it, to your point, you expanded and shrunk at the same time, which is so interesting, because you, you can expand your your tech, your what you do for this firm. You can also expand geographically. Now in the in the case of legal, you're probably going to be tied to the US market, or firms that have very similar legal structure countries. But you're not you don't need to be focused in Minnesota, or Texas, you can be focused any really anywhere where where law firms exist in the United States, and that m&a strategy can help push that as well.
Dennis Dimka 27:48
I couldn't agree more.
Ryan Barnett 27:50
Yeah. The other thing that is fascinating is that you took a chunk of something that would be quote unquote, traditional outside of technology. And you went into that digital in digital marketing, because it was a law firm and legal focus, it allows you to pull that off, because you know, how these firms are going to, to, to act? Do you see some cross sell and upsell opportunities from from the different divisions because of this vertical market focus?
Dennis Dimka 28:26
Yes, absolutely. Um, you know, I think some people might see verticalization as limiting, but in a way it opens up opportunities. For instance, you know, an adjacency strategy, like like we did with our acquisition of juris page. So yes. So, you know, we got to a certain point, we were growing organically, we're doing well. And we but we were purely a tech company. And we always will be we're always be a tech company at heart. But we kind of decided, you know, from a philosophical perspective, almost, we want to help law firms with more than just the gears and the bits and the bytes, right, we want to help them manage their firm or manage their technology and grow their practice. So the mantra we adopted as we help law firms manage and grow their firms. Well, digital marketing, so again, think SEO, PPC, digital advertising, that kind of thing, is one degree but only one degree away from our core business or first business. And if it serves law firms, it's it's a for us, as a classic one plus one equals three and for our clients, and yeah, it was obviously without a verticalization strategy that would have not even occurred to us and probably wouldn't have made
Ryan Barnett 29:45
That makes a ton of sense. Dennis, you've already mentioned a piece of advice, but is there kind of any one piece of advice you'd give to listeners about building and maintaining go to market strategy, like you've done.
Dennis Dimka 30:08
Number one, you should do it, I think, right in almost every case. So many things, just as I've said a few times now snap into focus become clear, probably, if you were to make an inventory of the five questions, keeping you up at night, the five unanswered questions, there's a good chance that having a good robust virtualization strategy will answer four or five of them, I would say, you know, again, I would advise picking one and that's what we did. And it's worked very, very well for us. But also advise, as I said earlier, don't half-ass it. And finally, it's a big change. And it's it needs to happen, in my opinion. And what made our successful was really doing a top to bottom in the organization, not just the marketing veneer, but like serve, offering development, service delivery, everything needs to be aligned to it. And that's a big undertaking. So just speaking from experience, we wouldn't have been able to do it successfully, I don't think without your guy's help. So my final piece of advice would be if you're considering it, you know, get a competent adviser, somebody who's helped technology companies make this kind of transformation before and who can help you navigate all the pieces of that process?
Ryan Barnett 31:25
Yeah, well, we appreciate the advice. And it's, it's a hard journey. It's one where you see a lot of people being trepidatious. And not everyone does dive into the pool. And so oftentimes, one of the things you'll see is, you know, what do you do with people are very afraid of the business that's incoming, and just the fact that if you're going to go in towards one market, you're gonna give up on a bunch of other markets, then some levels, you do need to do that, but others it is a process that takes a bit of time. Dennis, how long did it take for you to get to this market and and focus in in Put, put efforts towards this.
Dennis Dimka 32:14
I think that the the transformation process, or like going through systematically going through our business and changing everything that needed to change, probably took a couple of quarters. But that was for what all considered like the main, okay, when we started, we were Uptime Systems, and when we ended we were Uptime Legal Systems, and our menu of services was live and launched and all that. But beyond that, I mean, but it's an ongoing kind of forever process to write that the meat of it was done. You mentioned, I think the thing that gives people some anxiety, and I want to touch on that really quick, cuz I think it's interesting. I believe the one the number one reason anyone has, you know, is tentative about jumping off that ledge is that future potential new business. And what I can say for us, is for every one prospective customer that maybe we lost or didn't get, because they came to our website, and they see we're all in on legal and they're not legal for every one of those that we lost, I can about guarantee we got three opportunities. And the quality was better, because we're already, you know, a third of the way there by being so clearly and unmistakably committed to their industry.
Ryan Barnett 33:33
Things like proposal development, and up quick because you're looking at the same things.
Dennis Dimka 33:39
Oh, absolutely. I mean, if we had an hour or more on this podcast, I would literally go through the many, many, many things that just oh, well, that answers that. Oh, well, that answers that. Okay. Well, now we can make this thing aligned to law firms from, like you say proposals to strategy to everything, everything just snaps in place?
Ryan Barnett 34:00
Absolutely.
Chelsey Nord 34:03
If I can jump in here, Dennis, I am excited about what you're talking about now. And it just makes me think like, you've clearly seen that specialization verticalization helps with with finding new customers, new logos, new revenue, and like, ultimately expanded market share. One thing we didn't ask for it or think about a little bit was how did it impact your current customer experience? So did you find that there was an impact packed on customer experience or retention that came along with this focus and elevated quality level that you're able to provide as you service your customers?
Dennis Dimka 34:40
So the impact the negative impact? I think the question is about our do we risk alienating existing clients? I thought that was a risk right? And it was one that we were willing to take the fallout so to speak was definitely less than I feared it would be you know, we had and we to this day, you know, like 10 years later to this day, we have clients from our generalist era where we provide services just because they like us so much. And their bill that they get from us says Uptime Legal Systems, even though there may be a manufacturing company, and to my surprise, 95% of them were just fine with that. So churn as a result of this was really pretty minimal, honestly.
Chelsey Nord 35:30
Thank you for sharing that. That's, that's good to hear. And certainly, you've seen that play out similarly with with other examples. One other follow up question I was going to ask is, you know, has Uptime Legal seen any quantitative results or return investment from this transformation? And if so, like, what, what would you? What would you gravitate towards the most? The highest value point?
Dennis Dimka 35:57
Yeah, so, you know, when I look at our year over year performance, and we look at revenue and profit, I mean, we have grown certainly high double digits, high teens, year over year growth, some years 20% or higher, with a, you know, a margin and net margin that we're really, really happy with, that's certainly a top, you know, top quartile in terms of profit, year over year over a year without missing a beat. And I couldn't tell you what it would have been without SVP, but I precisely. But I can say with a lot of confidence, it would be a lot less, both in terms of growth and the profit, right, less growth, because we stand out less and less profit, because, like you like, like we talked about earlier, those efficiencies aren't there. And, and, you know, there's a lot of price pressure when your generalist, so both, you know, both revenue and profit would have been far less, had we not gone through that process.
Ryan Barnett 37:06
Dennis, we love the focus here and the approach that you've taken. And I appreciate you sharing your experiences and being part of this, Chelsey and Matt, I'll turn it over to you for a few few questions here. And, and we'll then turn it over to Dennis to chat share anything else you'd like to share?
Matt Lockhart 37:31
Ah, well, you know, I don't have any additional questions. All I'll say is, is look out for further continued growth of Uptime Legal. We're, we're, we're obviously super excited with what you've done. You know, I think we feel really lucky that we've had the opportunity to work with you, Dennis. And, and not just you, but your I, the team behind you, which, you know, I can safely say is a real strength of Uptime Legal and, and know that there's, you know, great things ahead for for you and your team. Thank you. Yeah, no, it's been it's been fun.
Dennis Dimka 38:24
And you guys have been very helpful along the way. Absolutely.
Chelsey Nord 38:29
Yeah, I think Matt nailed it there, I would just echo his sentiment and just add on that, you know, there's nothing better we love, we love to see our customers win. So to see the success you've had, it's just super exciting. And we know that there'll be even more to come. So thank you for sharing your journey, Dennis.
Dennis Dimka 38:47
Absolutely. Thank you.
Matt Lockhart 38:50
Yeah, and with that, you know, Dennis, we know, I hope we're going to put a little extra promotion around this, I think, to the legal market, because they should be talking to you guys. And so, you know, thank you so much, again, for taking your time with us today. The shoot the moon podcast, I think this is a highlight for us, and a highlight for this podcast. So, so thank you so much.
Dennis Dimka 39:28
Absolutely. It's been a lot of fun.
Matt Lockhart 39:31
Okay. And with that, we'll ring those immortal words of our founding partner, Mike Harvath. And we'll tie a ribbon on it for this episode of the shoot the moon podcast. Please join us next week as we'll explore more interesting and in depth topics around the IT services marketplace and, mergers and acquisitions thanks so much for being here!